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404notfound
Mar 5, 2006

stop staring at me

I was liking gunbreaker for a while, feeling pretty good about learning the role, but a few missteps in the Alexander raids have set my confidence back a bit. There are a couple fights in the series that require (or heavily encourage) tank swaps, and not knowing that going in can make for a pretty bad time. I guess there are certain tells, like when an attack has "double" in the name, or you see special vulnerability stacks building up on the main tank. But in A5N, with the goblin that grows big, I didn't know you wanted to specifically wait for the concussion on the fourth stack (which clears the stacks) before swapping, so I ended up putting us both at three stacks. Plus there's still the occasional dungeon that gives me trouble, like the first part of Bardam's Mettle, and I feel like a bad tank when I end up pulling too much and dying.

On the other hand, I also picked up sage recently, and once I wrapped my head around the toolkit, it's been a much easier time. You really don't need to know a whole lot about any given encounter, even going in completely blind. Remember the names of raid-wide attacks and try to Kerachole/E-Prog the next time they come up, then just use whatever skill is appropriate to keep the tank's health from dropping too much/too quickly. In dungeons, the tank is the one deciding how much to pull, and I just have to try and heal through the damage.

I'll probably come around again on gunbreaker soon, but right now I feel like I just have to get better at reading encounters in general. I actually find it easier as sage than as my first job, dragoon, which takes just a little too much attention to remember the "proper" sequences of various oGCD skills to weave between the very rigid 10-GCD rotation while also trying to focus on mechanics

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Antivehicular
Dec 30, 2011


I wanna sing one for the cars
That are right now headed silent down the highway
And it's dark and there is nobody driving And something has got to give

404notfound posted:

Plus there's still the occasional dungeon that gives me trouble, like the first part of Bardam's Mettle, and I feel like a bad tank when I end up pulling too much and dying.

If it's any comfort, the first section of Bardam's Mettle is widely regarded as one of the most challenging pulls in the post-ARR game; the caster mobs can do a ton of damage during the pull, and if you're going for full pulls to the minibosses, it can add up even without doing anything wrong. Those pulls suck and needing to split them doesn't make you a bad tank.

Schwartzcough
Aug 12, 2009

Don't tease the Octopus, kids!
Also, that Alexander fight is like the only time tank swaps come up in normal difficulty content, and usually just results in the tank dying. That flight in general is kind of a mess unless most people remember the gimmicks.

Antivehicular
Dec 30, 2011


I wanna sing one for the cars
That are right now headed silent down the highway
And it's dark and there is nobody driving And something has got to give

Oh yeah, "nobody remembers the gimmick and it takes a few deaths/a wipe to get people sorted" is the natural state of a lot of the Alex raids

Maximum Tomfoolery
Apr 12, 2010

Most of the game has a very consistent visual language, but while they've updated a lot of old content, they haven't really touched Alexander. There's a lot of mechs that will tear you apart, but it doesn't telegraph what you're supposed to do. It doesn't quite fit modern encounter design, and getting blown up a few times is easily forgivable.

I still don't know how Brawler works and I don't plan to learn.

e: and Bardam's Mettle is notorious for having a few really hairy wall-pulls. Just don't try to rush it and you'll be ok.

Maximum Tomfoolery fucked around with this message at 02:37 on May 1, 2024

GilliamYaeger
Jan 10, 2012

Call Gespenst!

404notfound posted:

I was liking gunbreaker for a while, feeling pretty good about learning the role, but a few missteps in the Alexander raids have set my confidence back a bit. There are a couple fights in the series that require (or heavily encourage) tank swaps, and not knowing that going in can make for a pretty bad time. I guess there are certain tells, like when an attack has "double" in the name, or you see special vulnerability stacks building up on the main tank. But in A5N, with the goblin that grows big, I didn't know you wanted to specifically wait for the concussion on the fourth stack (which clears the stacks) before swapping, so I ended up putting us both at three stacks. Plus there's still the occasional dungeon that gives me trouble, like the first part of Bardam's Mettle, and I feel like a bad tank when I end up pulling too much and dying.

On the other hand, I also picked up sage recently, and once I wrapped my head around the toolkit, it's been a much easier time. You really don't need to know a whole lot about any given encounter, even going in completely blind. Remember the names of raid-wide attacks and try to Kerachole/E-Prog the next time they come up, then just use whatever skill is appropriate to keep the tank's health from dropping too much/too quickly. In dungeons, the tank is the one deciding how much to pull, and I just have to try and heal through the damage.

I'll probably come around again on gunbreaker soon, but right now I feel like I just have to get better at reading encounters in general. I actually find it easier as sage than as my first job, dragoon, which takes just a little too much attention to remember the "proper" sequences of various oGCD skills to weave between the very rigid 10-GCD rotation while also trying to focus on mechanics
Yeah as people have said that's the only tank swap in the normal game (and thank loving god for that, tank swapping with pugs on a regular basis would be a nightmare) and to add onto it the first few pulls on Bardam's Mettle are brutal. Even I, someone who double pulls every chance I get, will hesitate unless I have a really good healer or am playing Warrior.

In Savage/Extreme content tank swaps are easy. Since hard content is more like learning a dance routine you'll always know exactly when to provoke/shirk.

orcane
Jun 13, 2012

Fun Shoe
It's the "obvious" and possibly the hardest hitting one, but definitely not the only one. Especially the Alex series has a lot of mechanics applying vuln debuffs of some sort and other mechanics you're supposed to share or swap tanks for. Newbie tanks often get flattened by them, especially since the EW stat squish made the Alex raids more dangerous (bosses last longer, fewer phases get skipped, bosses hit harder). Most of these mechanics are survivable if you anticipate them with mitigations or a shield healer, but they can all be deadly with bad healers, bad gear or without proper cooldown use.

A3: Pepsiman hands deal blunt resistance down, you're supposed to offtank the 2nd hand in a different direction but nobody ever does, so the stacks add up very quickly. In the final phase the regular cleave will also add the blunt resistance down debuff, if the boss doesn't die fast enough you'll die or have to swap.
A5: Already covered, you're supposed to swap just before Ratfinx Twinkledinks' tankbuster, but it's still survivable if you're swapping sooner (you'll have fewer vuln stacks).
A6: Brawler's double laser should be shared.
A7: Uplander doom will stack physical vulnerability up on the current MT, swap or challenge your healers.
A8: Onslaughter's perpetual ray will add magic vulnerability up, if you don't swap you may or may not die to hydrothermal missile. Brute Justice's double rocket punch should be shared.
A9: Faust Z has a big cleave that has the potential to one-shot tanks, but it can be shared with the 2nd tank.

orcane fucked around with this message at 14:20 on May 1, 2024

Arist
Feb 13, 2012

who, me?


O4 also has a tank swap iirc, but that's one of the only times I can remember in anything less than an Extreme, and it's definitely the most recent one in one of those I'm aware of.

World War Mammories
Aug 25, 2006


e4n has a tankbuster that applies a vuln, but it's very mild and can easily be ignored

Orcs and Ostriches
Aug 26, 2010


The Great Twist
A lot of these tank busters are overgeared by three tiers of ilvl at this point, so they hit like a noodle regardless. The o4 and e4 ones were easier to do the swap properly than heal through at the time.

I think E10 also has one but just doesn’t do any appreciable damage if you have the vuln. It’s kinda a shame they’re tuned quite so easily. They could have a tank vulnerable marker or something to help out newer players.

Bruceski
Aug 21, 2007

The tools of a hero mean nothing without a solid core.

orcane posted:

A9: Faust Z has a big cleave that has the potential to one-shot tanks, but it can be shared with the 2nd tank.

:O that's a split tankbuster? I've been doing "hit mitigation and pray" this whole time.

Nichael
Mar 30, 2011


sorry wrong thread!

1stGear
Jan 16, 2010

Here's to the new us.
Wrong thread

Nitrousoxide
May 30, 2011

do not buy a oneplus phone



Well, I'll grant that's simpler

Xerophyte
Mar 17, 2008

This space intentionally left blank

Nitrousoxide posted:

Well, I'll grant that's simpler



Yeah, there's a major DDOS attack ongoing. I'm seeing similar things trying to log on the EU servers.

Nitrousoxide
May 30, 2011

do not buy a oneplus phone



I really love the soundtrack to Foundation. Probably my favorite music I've encountered so far.

The Archbishop has a great VA. And he speaks a good game about wanting to defeat the ascians. That said, ain't no one who's not a bad guy who's got a church organ music accompaniment in a Final Fantasy game lol.

snoremac
Jul 27, 2012

I LOVE SEEING DEAD BABIES ON 𝕏, THE EVERYTHING APP. IT'S WORTH IT FOR THE FOLLOWING TAB.
Foundation and a later version of the same music are my favourite tracks in the game. Stormblood and Shadowbringers also have some great ones, while nothing popped for me in EW.

snoremac fucked around with this message at 06:16 on May 9, 2024

Feldegast42
Oct 29, 2011

COMMENCE THE RITE OF SHITPOSTING

EW has some great music but StB and especially Shadowbringers are a tough act to follow

Attack on Princess
Dec 15, 2008

To yolo rolls! The cause and solution to all problems!
Is it possible to get more of the older irregular tomestones during this Treasure Trove?

I'm guessing it's all Genesis II tomes now, but had to ask to be sure.

Antivehicular
Dec 30, 2011


I wanna sing one for the cars
That are right now headed silent down the highway
And it's dark and there is nobody driving And something has got to give

Attack on Princess posted:

Is it possible to get more of the older irregular tomestones during this Treasure Trove?

I'm guessing it's all Genesis II tomes now, but had to ask to be sure.

Yeah, unfortunately it's just gonna be Genesis II now. It's sort of unfortunate that they went with the same name when these mogtomes don't work any differently from any other.

GloomMouse
Mar 6, 2007

Should've used "Procrastination" since they're used for collecting old stuff mostly

Nitrousoxide
May 30, 2011

do not buy a oneplus phone



I've just passed the Moogle village in The Churning Mists, and I'm really liking this MSQ in this arc so far. It's felt a lot more tightly plotted with a much more lean cast of characters with a very well-defined goal compared to the much more nebulous one for much of ARR. And seeing the same cast of characters really get to know each other and grow over MSQ quest after MSQ quest has really served the story a lot better compared to jumping around between small sets of a huge cast like in ARR.

snoremac
Jul 27, 2012

I LOVE SEEING DEAD BABIES ON 𝕏, THE EVERYTHING APP. IT'S WORTH IT FOR THE FOLLOWING TAB.
I could be over-forgiving of some faults, but ARR had so much worldbuilding to cover both for new players and returnees from the original XIV that its slow pace sticks out. I think from HW onwards things are mostly much better. There are slogs here and there but nothing on the level of ping-ponging from NPC to NPC to NPC to complete fetch quests that gradually fill in world details without much plot development in ARR. But it is a shame that their storytelling chops don't properly show until late ARR, from what I recall.

Kwyndig
Sep 23, 2006

Heeeeeey


Nitrousoxide posted:

I've just passed the Moogle village in The Churning Mists, and I'm really liking this MSQ in this arc so far. It's felt a lot more tightly plotted with a much more lean cast of characters with a very well-defined goal compared to the much more nebulous one for much of ARR. And seeing the same cast of characters really get to know each other and grow over MSQ quest after MSQ quest has really served the story a lot better compared to jumping around between small sets of a huge cast like in ARR.

Meanwhile the sidequests for that zone are some of the worst in the game, they're too many of them, their content quite frankly is terrible, and the rewards are HW standard or anemic by today's standards. I wouldn't recommend doing the sidequests except that a tribal faction is locked behind a lengthy quest chain in that zone, it used to be longer but they nerfed the unlock point so now you don't have to do the whole thing.

GloomMouse
Mar 6, 2007

The tribe gives the best dance so it's worth it

Nitrousoxide
May 30, 2011

do not buy a oneplus phone



I liked the 50-60 dark knight quest a lot more than 30-50.

Runa
Feb 13, 2011

They both teach important lessons for a Dark Knight to learn and everything comes together in the 60-70 segment in a pretty satisfying way.

It's one of the few job questlines that feels like it has an actual, honest to goodness grand finale.

Qwertycoatl
Dec 31, 2008

Nitrousoxide posted:

I've just passed the Moogle village in The Churning Mists, and I'm really liking this MSQ in this arc so far. It's felt a lot more tightly plotted with a much more lean cast of characters with a very well-defined goal compared to the much more nebulous one for much of ARR. And seeing the same cast of characters really get to know each other and grow over MSQ quest after MSQ quest has really served the story a lot better compared to jumping around between small sets of a huge cast like in ARR.

Yeah also having the NPCs come along with you on a road trip is way better than Minfilia sitting at home and asking you to come back and receive your next task in a meeting that should have been a linkpearl mesage

girl dick energy
Sep 30, 2009

You think you have the wherewithal to figure out my puzzle vagina?


Nitrousoxide posted:

I've just passed the Moogle village in The Churning Mists, and I'm really liking this MSQ in this arc so far. It's felt a lot more tightly plotted with a much more lean cast of characters with a very well-defined goal compared to the much more nebulous one for much of ARR. And seeing the same cast of characters really get to know each other and grow over MSQ quest after MSQ quest has really served the story a lot better compared to jumping around between small sets of a huge cast like in ARR.

Qwertycoatl posted:

Yeah also having the NPCs come along with you on a road trip is way better than Minfilia sitting at home and asking you to come back and receive your next task in a meeting that should have been a linkpearl mesage
:hmmyes:

I think I've mentioned it before, HW was where the writers realized that "hey, WoL, go grab 10 bear asses, I'll stand here while you do that" feels bad, but you can get the exact same mechanical effect with "hey, WoL, we need 20 bear asses, I'll get half and you get half and we'll meet back here in an hour" and have it feel a lot better.

girl dick energy fucked around with this message at 17:59 on May 17, 2024

Kwyndig
Sep 23, 2006

Heeeeeey


Yeah even though it's fictional it feels like the NPCs are pulling their weight because the narrative is assigning them bullshit tasks too. At least once they even do most of the work and leave you with five bear asses to collect which is nice.

Nitrousoxide
May 30, 2011

do not buy a oneplus phone



girl dick energy posted:

:hmmyes:

I think I've mentioned it before, HW was where the writers realized that "hey, WoL, go grab 10 bear asses, I'll stand here while you do that" feels bad, but you can get the exact same mechanical effect with "hey, WoL, we need 20 bear asses, I'll get half and you get half and we'll meet back here in an hour" and have it feel a lot better.

Yeah, for sure, having Alphinaud come with you on something like a trip back to Ishgard to overcome some roadblock you've encountered is just a way better experience than getting orders from someone sitting behind a desk 3 loading screens away who demands you come back for an in-person meeting.

Feldegast42
Oct 29, 2011

COMMENCE THE RITE OF SHITPOSTING

Kwyndig posted:

Yeah even though it's fictional it feels like the NPCs are pulling their weight because the narrative is assigning them bullshit tasks too. At least once they even do most of the work and leave you with five bear asses to collect which is nice.

Especially when you go off and collect the bear asses and you run into them also collecting bear asses in the field

Sunday Morning
Apr 7, 2007

Easy
Smellrose
It just feels more FF to have a party of your npc buds along to help you solve the world's problems. It's also great for actually developing those characters. By the end of Shadowbringers the list of who are my favorite Scions is very different from ARR.

reversefungi
Nov 27, 2003

Master of the high hat!
This reminds me of a great moment in SHB or post-SHB(?) where you're getting a laundry list of items you'll have to go fetch and you start thinking "Ugh seriously, they're really going to make me run around and grab all that?" Only for G'raha to step in an go "you're a busy WoL who has saved the world far too many times, just sit back while I handle all this menial crap"

Nitrousoxide
May 30, 2011

do not buy a oneplus phone



Man, after a lot of music highs I just hit The Sea of Clouds and boy does this place have the most generic rear end elevator music ever.

Professor Beetus
Apr 12, 2007

They can fight us
But they'll never Beetus

Nitrousoxide posted:

Man, after a lot of music highs I just hit The Sea of Clouds and boy does this place have the most generic rear end elevator music ever.

You gotta go down to the little Gundu tribe quest area for the good stuff

GloomMouse
Mar 6, 2007

Yeah the upper area is better, and the tribe home area is really good

Polderjoch
Jun 27, 2019

May the sacred flame guide me... Or something like that.
Just finished Sophia Extreme on minimum item level without echo as an AST and goddamn that's definitely one of the most satisfying fights i've ever seen, got to see my AST LB3 for the first time and we killed her right as what i presume is her enrage mechanic was about to wipe us. Healing on Astrologian feels so good yall, Astrodyne gives so much MP i'm going to miss it so bad when they rework it

Now just got three more extremes to go before I can start stormblood :yaycat:
I hit the Post-HW credits roll yesterday and I'm honestly not sure how I feel about going into Stormblood, HW had so many good hooks, and whereas SB's setup hasn't grabbed me that much beyond it being interesting to see what Lyse will end up being going forward. I'll still always be sad Ysayle isn't here as well though, that death was painful as hell. It's also pretty bittersweet leaving Ishgard behind, I didn't expect to care much about it since the other three city-states really just felt like a whatever backdrop I didn't particularly care for, but Ishgard really ended up feeling like a home, I teleported there to turn in some Centurio Seals and it really hit me how I just hadn't actually been there in a fair while, and probably won't really have much reason to return to going forward. The writing really did a great job at making me care about not just the npcs but the city as a whole.

Polderjoch fucked around with this message at 21:01 on May 20, 2024

Bruceski
Aug 21, 2007

The tools of a hero mean nothing without a solid core.

Polderjoch posted:

Just finished Sophia Extreme on minimum item level without echo as an AST and goddamn that's definitely one of the most satisfying fights i've ever seen, got to see my AST LB3 for the first time and we killed her right as what i presume is her enrage mechanic was about to wipe us. Healing on Astrologian feels so good yall, Astrodyne gives so much MP i'm going to miss it so bad when they rework it

Now just got three more extremes to go before I can start stormblood :yaycat:
I hit the Post-HW credits roll yesterday and I'm honestly not sure how I feel about going into Stormblood, HW had so many good hooks, and whereas SB's setup hasn't grabbed me that much beyond it being interesting to see what Lyse will end up being going forward. I'll still always be sad Ysayle isn't here as well though, that death was painful as hell. It's also pretty bittersweet leaving Ishgard behind, I didn't expect to care much about it since the other three city-states really just felt like a whatever backdrop I didn't particularly care for, but Ishgard really ended up feeling like a home, I teleported there to turn in some Centurio Seals and it really hit me how I just hadn't actually been there in a fair while, and probably won't really have much reason to return to going forward. The writing really did a great job at making me care about not just the npcs but the city as a whole.

Are you doing all the extremes min-ilevel no echo or was that just the party finder that showed up? I'm impressed, those are no joke.

And yeah, a lot of folks wind up really settling into Ishgard. It gets the whole expansion to be the center of the focus, warts and all. Its player resources are a bit too spread out but I'm always happy when I have a reason to teleport back to Foundation.

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Alxprit
Feb 7, 2015

<click> <click> What is it with this dancing?! Bouncing around like fools... I would have thought my own kind at least would understand the seriousness of our Adventurer's Guild!

Hey, since Dawntrail is coming up, I wanted to ask if there are any changes you all would like to see to the OP. I already did a cursory update to align with the new state of the free trial but it's possible I may have missed some things. Or there are things that really should be covered that aren't, or vice versa. Whatever works, I'm open!

I'd also like to ask for suggestions for a better thread title, since the one I came up with has apparently not been very well received.

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